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General Public Section => Off Topic => Section of Science => Topic started by: ZOldDude on February 05, 2008, 10:53:36 pm

Title: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 05, 2008, 10:53:36 pm
(http://homepage.eircom.net/~miscellaneous/images/animath.jpg)
Can -you- answere it?
I can.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: [TKC]Symantic on February 06, 2008, 11:27:59 am
(http://homepage.eircom.net/~miscellaneous/images/animath.jpg)
Can -you- answere it?
I can.

well, x = "nothing" but the answer to the equation could be "26" or "-7=19".
not possible to solve.

first get the variables all on one side if i remember right, but you subtract x from one side and then the other, there is no more X, just -7=19, or you could do that later and add 7 to both sides which leaves you with "x=26+x", then subtract an x from both sides then that leaves you with the answer 26, but not x=26 because of the fact X no longer lives in this equation.

Soo, where is my cookie?

Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: IllAssembly on February 12, 2008, 04:43:05 am
x-7= 19+x


no solution  :icon_thumbsup
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 12, 2008, 05:29:14 am
x-7= 19+x


no solution  :icon_thumbsup
Yes there is.
What is the value of X?
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: IllAssembly on February 12, 2008, 10:02:14 pm
this is what i come up with:

Simplifying
x + -7 = x + 19

Reorder the terms:
-7 + x = x + 19

Reorder the terms:
-7 + x = 19 + x

Add '-1x' to each side of the equation.
-7 + x + -1x = 19 + x + -1x

Combine like terms: x + -1x = 0
-7 + 0 = 19 + x + -1x
-7 = 19 + x + -1x

Combine like terms: x + -1x = 0
-7 = 19 + 0
-7 = 19

Solving
-7 = 19

The left and right sides are not equal, therefore there is no solution.



Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 13, 2008, 11:04:34 am
this is what i come up with:

Simplifying
x + -7 = x + 19

Reorder the terms:
-7 + x = x + 19

Reorder the terms:
-7 + x = 19 + x

Add '-1x' to each side of the equation.
-7 + x + -1x = 19 + x + -1x

Combine like terms: x + -1x = 0
-7 + 0 = 19 + x + -1x
-7 = 19 + x + -1x

Combine like terms: x + -1x = 0
-7 = 19 + 0
-7 = 19

Solving
-7 = 19

The left and right sides are not equal, therefore there is no solution.




Quote
The left and right sides are not equal, therefore there is no solution.
Yes both sides ARE equal.
The statement SAYS they are.
The question is therefore ...what is the value of X.

Like most people your just trying too hard and are over looking the simple way to solve the problem while the answere is right in front of you with neon lights pointing it out...so to speak.
I see people do this all the time when trying to make a cheat work or bypass an anti-cheat system.
Just stop thinking so hard.
The answere is -very- simple!

With a -simple- puzzle like this those schooled in "higher" ways of working things out almost always fail becuase they are trying to use everything they have been taught to figuare it out.

That is the wrong way to think.

It is like training for self protection...follow the basics and the body does without the mind stopping to think about it.

Relax your mind and let it go back to the basics.
Put yourself back on autopilot (yes I flew aircraft and have a licence...still).
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 13, 2008, 12:19:03 pm
Moved from the RIB Section and the Hmmmmmmmmmmm Totpic to here....for you "brainiacs" to solve.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: hoax-ravenheckler on February 13, 2008, 03:26:46 pm
x  = 6?
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: IllAssembly on February 14, 2008, 02:23:35 am
LOL dude i even google equation solver'd it. maybe in computer program world theres an answer but im pretty sure in the math game theres no solution do to the givin rules but lol maybe i am missing  the point    :arr     arr
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: Vicious on February 21, 2008, 06:56:57 am
The equation is simplified into x^2 = 26. So x = the square root of 26. Which cannot be simplified any and according to google calculator is 5.09901951.

Edit i just realized that's a positive X, not negative. Ha ha, guess i'm stupid too  :icon_laugh
So all that i just typed is wrong... :icon_rolleyes2
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 21, 2008, 11:56:45 am
I wonder how long I should let people work on this befor I tell them what "X" is?
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: hoax-ravenheckler on February 21, 2008, 04:21:55 pm
I wonder how long I should let people work on this befor I tell them what "X" is?

How long did it took before you found it?
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 21, 2008, 09:40:12 pm
As soon as I saw it.
It is the only possible way for the statment to be correct and it is not a natural number.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: [TKC]Symantic on February 21, 2008, 10:14:03 pm
i get it, x = Y

where y = whatever the fuck i want it to.

or X just =x and leave it at that.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 21, 2008, 11:26:46 pm
It is soooooooo simple.
If "X" can have natural number added/subtracted and still remain equal...then the same -will- hold true if you divied/multiply...therefor "X" can -only- be one thing in math.

I hated math in school and the reason I last did programming back in 1984 was becuase at the time it was almost pure math and ATARI BASIC had just came out that made it easyer.
You C* guys have it easy.

Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: IllAssembly on February 22, 2008, 04:10:17 am
dude fuckin make sense of it then already im stickin to my answer of  -7=19 [not equal to] therefore x is undefined or -no solution-  at least by correctly using the right procedure. so explain tcrew
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: MrMedic on February 22, 2008, 06:30:55 am
You C* guys have it easy.

lol dont they just
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: MrMedic on February 22, 2008, 06:33:31 am
dude fuckin make sense of it then already im stickin to my answer of  -7=19 [not equal to] therefore x is undefined or -no solution-  at least by correctly using the right procedure. so explain tcrew

i'd rather have cream cake or a nice forrest gateugh .. personally lol

i just posted this and it says ive edited it ( i have now ) but i didnt , server in trouble again?
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 22, 2008, 07:23:37 am
No problems buddy.
BTW...you -do- see the answere to the vaule of "X" right?
PM me if you know it or if even you are stumped...it is so easy smart people overlook it.

I might let these younger guys have the answere this Sunday...or not.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: IllAssembly on February 22, 2008, 07:44:19 am
dude i was the shit in my math class and im not such a hacker but im extremely profficient with computers and im 21!  my answer stands. final answer = no solution x is undefined -7 does not equal 19 :icon_teehee
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 22, 2008, 09:46:45 am
dude i was the shit in my math class and im not such a hacker but im extremely profficient with computers and im 21!  my answer stands. final answer = no solution x is undefined -7 does not equal 19 :icon_teehee
Well your wrong becuase "X" -does- have a value and it makes the statement correct.
It is -really- not that hard of a puzzle!

I am going to invite both Doolittle and JBOY (who defaced the main TKC page a few days ago) into this. They claim to be smart and I know that at least Mr.D has a computer science diploma....but I doubt even they can figure this out...they may also "think too hard".
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: IllAssembly on February 22, 2008, 10:11:17 am
are you -1 trying 1- to -say- that u add -1 to each side cs that doesnt work either
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 22, 2008, 10:28:31 am
are you -1 trying 1- to -say- that u add -1 to each side cs that doesnt work either
No.
I already said that the math -statement is correct- and that the value of "X" is what you need to answer....and that value is -not- a commonly used math function.

So far everyone who has tried to answere and used the most common (and generally  correct) math solving skills has totaly overlooked the -simple answere-.
I PM'ed Doolittle and sent a text msg to JBOY's phone.
Lets see if they want to "school" you guys...if they can even get this correct themselfs that is.

This site has three staff members that are Uni teachers and at LEAST 4 others who also have a Computer Science Diplomas who are long time members (who may not even see this thread)....but the statment is correct and "X" does have a value even if they read this thread and do not see the answere themselfs.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 22, 2008, 11:25:31 am
OK...
I was in MSN IM with both Accessed and Symantic and told them the answere.
They are NOT going to post it and are NOT going to give it away in PM/IM.
The point is they see the correct answere and both went...LOL!...when they did.
It is really a very simple and valid function/value/answere.

It is so simple that even most Math Instuctors will overlook it!

Like I said the smarter you are and more trained you are to think works against you becuse you "think" too hard to answere it.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 22, 2008, 01:09:15 pm
This is an exorcise in general thinking and problem solving.

Many times a programming issue may have you stumped...and the reason is -not- that you do not have the knowlage needed to solve the issue,but that the way you -think- with the skills you have studied and mastered that are holding you back from what looks you in your face.

More often than not in real life needs...thinking too hard is a detriment next to standing back with a clear mind and just "feeling" what the answere is and more functional than beating your schooled brains out on it.

The main problem with this puzzle is that it is -so- simple and transparent.
Step back and not think so hard.

Now what is the value of "X" which makes the statement correct?
The answere is -very simple-!
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: hoax-ravenheckler on February 22, 2008, 02:57:14 pm
I know I'm thinking to hard and I'm trying to simplify anything. Though I can't figure it out.
I have a few idea's but I can't work them out and that SUCKS. (I hate the Windows Calculator).

When I'm at home I'll work something out.

If your on Z let me know. And I'll tell you in what way I'm thinking.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: Frank P. on February 22, 2008, 03:11:22 pm
I know I'm thinking to hard and I'm trying to simplify anything. Though I can't figure it out.
I have a few idea's but I can't work them out and that SUCKS. (I hate the Windows Calculator).

When I'm at home I'll work something out.

If your on Z let me know. And I'll tell you in what way I'm thinking.
Windows calculator sucks major ass. I tried to use it a couple of days ago and either I missed it or it has no Minus function lol...
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: hoax-ravenheckler on February 22, 2008, 04:30:28 pm
It does. It's next to the 3.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: Vicious on February 22, 2008, 06:13:13 pm
Or just enable numlock and use your keypad... :icon_rolleyes2
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 23, 2008, 12:16:59 am
LOL!
Most calculators are not going to help you with this...in fact I doubt any calculator or a Cray HPC will.

Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: Frank P. on February 23, 2008, 06:19:54 am
It does. It's next to the 3.
Ah it does. Ty, +1 :D
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: MrMedic on February 23, 2008, 06:29:21 am
LOL!
Most calculators are not going to help you with this...in fact I doubt any calculator or a Cray HPC will.



lol im suprised no body has posted the answer yet

its said i edited again lol
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: Vicious on February 23, 2008, 07:26:15 am
I've got it. It's an imaginary number with a symbol that cannot be drawn by a human hand! It's the mark of Chaos! :darkking
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 23, 2008, 11:36:11 am
I've got it. It's an imaginary number with a symbol that cannot be drawn by a human hand! It's the mark of Chaos! :darkking
OK...I am going to give everyone a big hint:
I can't put the symbol into either MSN IM or ICQ but I can in a forum post.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: Frank P. on February 23, 2008, 12:19:14 pm
 :icon_magician Is it magic? I think maybe it's a squared number.. I dunno just a guess.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: Vicious on February 23, 2008, 05:37:25 pm
Eh square root, or lowercase i maybe? I dunno, i'm just guessing in the dark here :icon_o_o
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: IllAssembly on February 23, 2008, 07:54:06 pm
infinite   -7 does not equal infinite + 19  if infinite is what your thinking
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 24, 2008, 01:17:07 am
infinite   -7 does not equal infinite + 19  if infinite is what your thinking
Close enough.
Your incorrect in your example however.
The value of "X" is "∞"....and no matter what you do to "∞" you can -never- change it's value.

Now see how -simple- that math problem was?!
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: [TKC]Symantic on February 24, 2008, 01:22:31 am
I don't agree with the answer as i said on ICQ.



Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 24, 2008, 01:33:21 am
I don't agree with the answer as i said on ICQ.
I never heard you disagree.

∞ is always ∞,by it's diffenition it can not change.

If you have an ENDLESS thing adding/subtracting/divideing/multiplying or any other interaction still leaves you with ENDLESS.

The only possible exception would be "∞ - ∞ =0"...you are still not changeing it's value but you are eleminating it.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: [TKC]Symantic on February 24, 2008, 01:36:47 am
graph it for me so i can see it.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 24, 2008, 01:43:27 am
graph it for me so i can see it.
Hhehe!

Best I can do is this:
(X-7)=(19+X)=X=∞
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: [TKC]Symantic on February 24, 2008, 03:35:19 am
isn't infinity undefined? so if x = infinity then x = undefined?

Pwnd :D
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 24, 2008, 04:18:53 am
isn't infinity undefined? so if x = infinity then x = undefined?

Pwnd :D
Quote
isn't infinity undefined?
In math it is definded.
Quote
Pwnd :D
Yeah...you were.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: IllAssembly on February 24, 2008, 05:20:51 am
LOL dude i thought this was a joke but u are serious LOL u made a topic about infinite  :icon_teehee  hey it beats some of mine though  :icon_teehee     but dude correct me if im wrong but in math ,right, infinite has no defined value its just 8 [sideways-couldnt find it on charmap] but like i said infinite + 7 is not equal to infinite -19


i was right!! the answer is no solution! now dive down to your wreckage and recover your valued belongings arrrrr  :arr
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: [TKC]Symantic on February 24, 2008, 05:43:06 am
LOL dude i thought this was a joke but u are serious LOL u made a topic about infinite  :icon_teehee  hey it beats some of mine though  :icon_teehee     but dude correct me if im wrong but in math ,right, infinite has no defined value its just 8 [sideways-couldnt find it on charmap] but like i said infinite + 7 is not equal to infinite -19


i was right!! the answer is no solution! now dive down to your wreckage and recover your valued belongings arrrrr  :arr

my point exactly.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: Vicious on February 24, 2008, 06:54:49 am
I'm with symantic on this. It's impossible to define infinite with a definite value (The words are pretty much opposites) so i'm gonna agree with /\ above me in saying it's undefined. And i'm sure if i put that on my calculus tests last year it would have been marked wrong. . .
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 24, 2008, 11:24:57 am
From part of the definition from a random page on math:
Quote
We may feel some discomfort at the idea that we can remove some of the elements of a set and still have as many as we started with, but this is an artifact of our experience with finite sets (in which removing something means having a smaller set). Infinite sets simply don't behave that way. In fact, this leads us to a definition:

"A set is infinite if we can remove some
of its elements without reducing its size."
Go look it up...
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 24, 2008, 11:34:51 am
Here is a good math site with more examples of what happens when you add/subtract/divide/muliply useing infinity:
http://tutorial.math.lamar.edu/Classes/CalcI/TypesOfInfinity.aspx
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: IllAssembly on February 24, 2008, 04:36:28 pm
crazy go search for the "string theory" its an example in deeper dimensions time doesnt exist in our dimension it is an illusion we use to measure our lifespan
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 25, 2008, 01:19:17 am
crazy go search for the "string theory" its an example in deeper dimensions time doesnt exist in our dimension it is an illusion we use to measure our lifespan
So?
It has nothing to do with the math problem I started the thread with or the examples of why it is a true statement...nor the question/answere that infenity -does- have diffinitions in math problems.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: Vicious on February 25, 2008, 01:32:16 am
Argh more calculus. I hate math. Entirely.  :icon_cry2
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: M. O. on February 25, 2008, 01:59:12 am
Well, to be very precise that equation has no solution actually. ∞ is no number, and you can't count with it as if it was a number. ∞ is mostly relevant only when you compute limits of a function.

But you can still think of it as a number and do some sloppy calculations, physicists or engineers like to do it that way. So infinity is a correct solution seen that way, but from a purely mathematical point of view it isn't.  :wink2

Infinites are dangerous. Say you have the equation x+2=24. If the above infinite solution is true, "nothing" says you can't add and take a number x+2+∞=24+∞. Then x+∞=∞ and x=0 (or any number, depends on how you do). Which obviously is no good solution.
//Engineering Physicist
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: IllAssembly on February 25, 2008, 04:57:19 am
yeah dude in math that is no solution -7 does not equal 19

but my post was saying that in our dimension infinite[time] is not real and we try to measure it.[time]

so maybe in another dimension like 5 or 6 maybe your equation is easily solvable. but not in ours  :icon_sly
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: M. O. on February 25, 2008, 05:22:47 am
What time is, is very difficult to understand. But I like the explanation someone had: time is what's measured by a clock.  :smile

However, there are many other things that can be thought of as infinite other than time.

Quote
infinite + 7 is not equal to infinite -19
The short answer is, in maths - no. In other sciences - yes.

Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: IllAssembly on February 25, 2008, 05:49:16 am
agreed



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/String_theory (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/String_theory)    but mullah, time is non existant. its only in our heads that all work the same way and agree on a way to measure our lifespan. we made it up, and named it "time"[broken down to the smallest as milliseconds] thats  just one way overlooked example of how incredibly intelligent people are.  a better name would be "life duration"
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: [TKC]Symantic on February 25, 2008, 06:12:09 am
time does not exist because chuck norris does not allow it.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: Frank P. on February 25, 2008, 08:54:31 am
time does not exist because chuck norris does not allow it.
No, Chuck Norris DECIDES what time it is.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: IllAssembly on February 25, 2008, 12:35:25 pm
chuk norris can lick the bottom of the bag
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: M. O. on February 25, 2008, 01:38:12 pm
I don't know much about the string theory but it isn't clear if it has anything to do with reality yet.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: Doolittle on February 25, 2008, 09:54:16 pm
You don't say?
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: M. O. on February 26, 2008, 03:44:47 am
A computer can understand the infinity as a sort of number and do some limited operations with it (like Z shows), but it's limited to those limited arithmetics. My 68k series calculator can do that  :wink2
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: ZOldDude on February 27, 2008, 10:08:35 am
Well E=MC2 is mostly not made of numbers but the statment is correct.

Bad example for what I am trying to say but my back hurts and I need sleep.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: [TKC]Anothercheater on February 28, 2008, 01:41:54 am
this is what i come up with:

Simplifying
x + -7 = x + 19

Reorder the terms:
-7 + x = x + 19

Reorder the terms:
-7 + x = 19 + x

Add '-1x' to each side of the equation.
-7 + x + -1x = 19 + x + -1x

Combine like terms: x + -1x = 0
-7 + 0 = 19 + x + -1x
-7 = 19 + x + -1x

Combine like terms: x + -1x = 0
-7 = 19 + 0
-7 = 19

Solving
-7 = 19

The left and right sides are not equal, therefore there is no solution.
LMFAO. You can do this much shorter:

x-7=19+x | -X
-7=19
(not logical)

There is no X which makes this equation possible.

x-7 != 19+x | -X
-7 != 19
QED.
Title: Re: Answere this!
Post by: IllAssembly on March 20, 2008, 05:38:33 am
Heh FU i lose my car keys all the time